1:39
these strengths you know, in, in abundance where we struggle.
>> Right.
>> And, and vice versa.
>> Yeah.
>> And I think that, the power of that is.
It starts to, it starts to get us to, to view kids and other adults.
>> Yeah.
>> Less as problems to be solved. >> Right.
>> And more as puzzles. >> Yeah.
>> Like why there's a sense of wonder. Like what was
>> Yeah. >> behind that child's action?
What was, you know, you know, why were they frustrated?
Why didn't they get over their frustration?
Why, you know, what would it take for them to work independently?
>> Right. >> With focus?
To me, that's the, the, the, the real
beauty of this work lies in that direction.
>> What are your concerns, worries about the work?
>> One of my worries would be that
people lose the forest from the, for the trees.
>> Mm-hm.
>> And that if the words become buzzwords or
are used to, to, to, to sort of penalize kids.
>> Mm.
I think that, you know, it just runs counter to this
sort of authentic strength-based approach that, that, that we're looking to have.
>> Right.
>> Recognizing that these behaviors and these strengths you know, aren't static.
>> Right. >> Aren't fixed.
If you, if, if,
>> Yeah. >> If there's a shared journey
this is going to be, there, there's remarkable power.
In this, if the adult attitude is we're better at this
>> Yeah. >> than you as kids.
I think that, you know, that will lead to a resentment.
>> Right.
>> Around the work and I think that would be unfortunate.
That's so, I mean, it like so resonates, I mean, I, I, you
know, so if you hear things about
discussions regarding formative verses summative assessment and
those are sort of buzzwords, but I do think the
formative model of sort of, we're all in an apprenticeship, right?
We're all in apprenticeship in life and if we view it that
way and, and, and frame it that way, this could have a really
interesting, disruptive effect on the way that I think, unfortunately, schools and
universities have become about, like, sort of, this is the grade you are.
And so you become, you get told you're
the C student. You become the C student.
>> Mm-hm.
>> And I think that sort of dis-, that determination,
that sort of deterministic part of that is really, really troubling.
And I'm hoping that this can, yeah I agree exactly
like if this could be, play a role to shift all
of that, and the way that we think about human
nature and human development that would be such a cool thing.
>> If you had your way here,
>> Right. >> what would you
want to change?
So I'd loved to have like, this sort of portfolio
that is a rich compilation that you are as an architect yourself as a student.
That you could construct as a student.
Actually I'd like to see teachers do the same type of
thing, and what I'd want them to show over a period of
years is that delta in a variety of different ways so it's
not just their delta in a standardized test score, but it's their,
the how they've managed to change their
approach to math, but also how they've managed
to develop some counter, character strength and
have shown a delta in the character strength.
That would be something that has a
richer notion of transformation in the, the trajectory
of transformation for a kid over a
number of years and could show that transformation.
That would be something that I would want.
And I then want the actual colleges to actually
say, hey, you know?
We're really fascinated by the voyage or the,
the journey that someone's made and shown that growth.
5:17
So I think there are these transformative >> Yeah.
>> moments that you can look back and say,
at that moment I could have gone in this direction.
>> Right.
>> Or this direction.
And I went hear and, it's like the whole Robert Frost, way leads on to way.
>> Right. >> Yeah
>> And all these good things happened. >> Yeah.
Yeah. And I think it's easy.
I, I actually think if,
if lots of people think about a
transformational moment in your life, right, something
that you sort of transformed who you are or made you into someone different.
I think a lot of it's tied to some of these strengths.
>> Yeah.
>> Playing out in that moment. >> Yeah.
>> Like I sometimes think of transformational moments in my life.
And you start thinking about these big things, right?
You know, you sort of marriage, or you
know, some moment that you graduate from a college.
And I actually think the, the sort of
micro transformational moments, the sort of day-to-day thing, but that
actually has a really significant way in that you shifted something.
By being able to identify that.
Because sometimes those things just happen and it's like a really minor thing.
But it actually has a pretty significant effect on the way that you do things.
And I, you know, I'm not big on sports analogies.
But I do think there is a lot to be learned from, you know, when you take in
kids of lots of different sort of, ability levels, and you work on a team with them.
And you're just trying to find that right lever
to get that kid to just develop a bit.
You know, try and improve a bit.
There, there individual sort of, performance.
And I think that's a really, we've got to become more like
that in the way that we work in schools, in the way
that we work with each other as adults.
I think we've gotta become more like those sort of coaches a bit.
So.