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So Ollie, in your work and experience, do you have any examples of managers
at all levels where perhaps aspects of Fayol or Mintzberg come to mind?
>> One of the very senior managers where I used to work,
she was very much a figurehead, disseminate, disturbance and
particularly when things needed to come back down the line quite quickly.
But in terms of the theory and the practice,
what was very clear to me is that it seems to increase as you go up the line.
And also, it's very difficult to have aspects of every
part of Mintzberg in your day-to-day practices.
It's not as easy as it may look on reading.
>> That's a really interesting point that we've had straightaway.
And that is, when you read the words of both the frameworks we've looked at,
their words, bringing them to life in
the reality of the workplace can be something that is completely different.
And so as well as what each of those words mean, we need to think about the skills
that you need to demonstrate alongside that, to make them work effectively.
And we've begun to see that at relatively senior levels of management,
your breadth of responsibility will get wider, but
also the level of influence that you have gets greater.
So for example,
in Ollie's example just now, this particular person is a figurehead.
Why, because everybody looks at the organizational hierarchy
at this particular person.
If something was to go a little bit off track, the higher the level,
the bigger the degree of influence you have to disturbance handle.
So to sort things out very quickly because people will listen to you.
Interestingly enough, when I worked as part of regional training
team that worked right away across the UK, I remember vividly my
manager at the time, enormously well-structured individual, very,
very personable, had very effective two-way relationships with all of us.
His planning was meticulous.
Everything we needed to know, we had an email.
And then we get a handout, and then we'd have a meeting.